[warriorscot]

The continenets areconstantly renewed at a verying rate some grow and some shrink depending on seismic events and gravitational fields. The problem with alot of geology is that all the seismology stuff is relativley new the whole field was reinvented about ten ears ago or so to accept a new more scientifically sound theory of seismology and plate tectonics in particular.

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Time is a constant, and nothing else even comes close, if you are travelling at the speed of light, it is said time may slow down for you, even if this is true(i believe it to be true to a degree)' if i am watching you travel at that speed the time is indeed constant, time for the individual may not be constant but the universal time will always pass, think about it, we have only sliced time into measurements.. even without these measurements it will always be constant..Nothing in this universe is constant bar time, one thing i know is definately not constant is the topic on this thread hehe .. oh yes, the soul, i find it very amusing just because 1 can think, they have a soul, evolution gave you the power to think up such nonsense, so dnt waste time entertaining such dribble

[Optikal]

Time is a constant, and nothing else even comes close, if you are travelling at the speed of light, it is said time may slow down for you, even if this is true(i believe it to be true to a degree)' if i am watching you travel at that speed the time is indeed constant, time for the individual may not be constant but the universal time will always pass, think about it, we have only sliced time into measurements.. even without these measurements it will always be constant..Nothing in this universe is constant bar time, one thing i know is definately not constant is the topic on this thread hehe .. oh yes, the soul, i find it very amusing just because 1 can think, they have a soul, evolution gave you the power to think up such nonsense, so dnt waste time entertaining such dribble

[dsenette]

they have a soul, evolution gave you the power to think up such nonsense, so dnt waste time entertaining such dribble

optikal....that's borderline offensive......watch your tone

[warriorscot]

Optikal i did a university level course in physics im my last year of high school and am studying a science and engineering degree at one of the worlds top institutions, TIME IS NOT A CONSTANT. What your talking about is frames of reference, time is constant to you in your frame of reference only. Read up on your relativity and scientific evidence and perform the calculations to prove it(i have dont the calculations backwards and fordwards and can derive them from first principles).

The only constant true to every frame of reference is the speed of light. And other constants apply to our universe and dimension, it doesnt include time.

This has gone completely off topic.

I read in the news today that Kansas said it was ok to teach divine intervention or something close to it(apparently they have just dressed up creationism in scientific jargon).

[Michael]

The only constant true to every frame of reference is the speed of light.

When it is going through a vacuum, to finish the sentence.

There is some science that is said to prove evolution.

There is also science to prove creation. What creationists like myself want is that science that proves creation to be taught, so people can see the other side of the issue.

[warriorscot]

If you are interested you can always find it out, however there is more science to prove evolution. Evolution is also not just a theory that can applied to living lifeforms but is present in most things we do or create, a good example that we are familiar with is computer software, the process taught to programmers is actually the same logical process described by a perfect evolution.

Yeah thanks for catching that the substance light passes through also affects the speed. But the speed through a vacum is always the same in every point of reference, its a bit of an akward principle its very abstract takes a while to get your head around.

Edited by warriorscot, 10 November 2005 - 05:29 PM.

[Optikal]

I cant honestly see where someone could take offense to what i said as it was not directed at anyone, i am sorry if i did offend anyone in anyway, i never take offense to anything anyone says as everyone has there own opinion. I have worked with time for over 14years now, i study cosmology (the universe)and spend every night of my life(if/when weather permits) staring at things few men can conceive, when it comes to pc's i am a total newb, but when it comes to the universe, its creation, its Evolution and its future there is little i do not understand... time.. it does not need an observer to exist, only times measurements can be manipulated, our perception of time can be warped in many different ways, but time without an observer will always be constant, i think a couple of us reading these posts can agree to dis-agree.. the topic, Divine Intervention should be left to the churchs, god knows there are enough of them round.

[Michael]

they have a soul, evolution gave you the power to think up such nonsense, so dnt waste time entertaining such dribble

That is calling me an idoit.

[MurderousMidget]

ok i am anwering the origional topic i didnt read all of the arguments so....

creationism or intelligent design should not be taught in a science classroom, there is no scientific data to support it. the arguments for creationism are all negative, that is to say they try to disprove evolution to prove creationism but science is not a matter of elimination,you must have evidence for your argument not against the other. even if this approach would prove creationism its main arguments are:
1 the law of thermo dynamics which basicly states things go from complex to more simple making evolving into more complex organisms impossible...but that law only applies in closed systems which biological systems are not
2 irreducible complexity which says that there are too many things that couldnt have slowly evolved into being because by missing any one part they dont work at all....ill use the blood clotting enzime example i read earlier those enzimes are actually modified versions of enzimes used in the digestive system, evolutions has retargeted and modified them to be used in another way, and do you not think before these enzimes were used to clot blood another was but this form was more efficient and became dominent?
3 man is no monkey....there are other forms of man that are not mutated apes or mutated humans ......neandertal are neither, while we did not evolve from there but alongside they are still a lower form of man and more resently a race of hobbit sized subhumans called flores was discovered on an indonesian island. not ape but not modern human either we all share the same evolutional ancestor


i personally think evolution is a tool used by god but my personal opinion doesnt matter when it comes to public schooling, there is seperation in church and state and there is no scientific data to support creationism and it does not belong in a science classroom. that being said i also think an evolution vs creationism class should be instated as elective if students which to learn about it as should a religions of the worlds class

[dsenette]

I cant honestly see where someone could take offense to what i said as it was not directed at anyone, i am sorry if i did offend anyone in anyway, i never take offense to anything anyone says as everyone has there own opinion.

i know that you don't take offense to anything (neither do i.) but someone could take offense...i wasn't trying to scold you....just...suggestiong you watch your town in an already possibly tense subject matter

I cant honestly see where someone could take offense to what i said as it was not directed at anyone, i am sorry if i did offend anyone in anyway, i never take offense to anything anyone says as everyone has there own opinion.

[Pi rules]

seperation in church and state

Sorry if someone already did this, but I just want to clarify the separation of Church and state. I am pretty sure that this was put in the Constitution to stop the government from making everyone believe one religion. This does not mean that religious things can't be posted on public property. However, this is just one interpretation, and I'm sure that there are others, and I'm not really a lawyer, so I'm not positive about what I said.

[warriorscot]

Try and keep it general(global) and not just should divine intervention be taught in American schools, i know most of the people on here are american but we have people on the site from everywhere and it excludes many of them as they see it as a debate for americans.

[dsenette]

i guess another question here would be...
if divine intervention was taught in school along with evolution....would you then have to teach all other accounts of the creation of the world? and if so would there be separate classes for each version of creation? would there be separate teacher?....there are certain religions that believe that the world was born from nothing by a giant snake.....just as an example.

i guess the problem comes up that the theory of divine intervention...is...basically a christian/Jewish belief system....what about religions who do not accept the old testament....or use any form of the bible (Hindu, buddhists, and the like)....would they need their own class that taught evolution and their form of creationism?

[warriorscot]

I suppose they would, good point, and as most of the world is of a non christain religion or indeed athiest then their beliefs should have priority if we were to be democratic about it.

[Michael]

if divine intervention was taught in school along with evolution....would you then have to teach all other accounts of the creation of the world?

I don't know, most likely I would think they would teach the science that suports creation.

Also there is a lot of differance in view on how evolution happened, normaly they one teach one version. That happens to also be the one that it was agreed back 30 years ago when a hole lot of evolutionists/scientist got togeather and agree that, one version (gradul change over millions of year) was wrong, and that punctuated equilibrium (sudden change with big gap in between) was right. You still hear more about the gradual change version of the theory.