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#16
MNOB07

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Interesting observation on the memory. The memory is actually pretty cheap for what it is and from a good name (so good it's already out of stock atm :blink: ) If you want to back down to 1GB that should be fine (still double what you got.) I guess when I picked it out I was so used to some Photoshop people craving as much RAM as they can get for all the layers some of em use :whistling:

This PC was selected with upgradability in mind, AM2 is fresh and will last a while, and even the next socket AMD cpus are supposed to be compatible with AM2. PCI-E x16 will be compatible with video cards for several years. True the next step up will naturally be PCI-E x32, but it is to be backwards compatible with x16 just as agp 8x was to agp 4x. Besides, video cards barely push up to 8x bandwidth right now. DDR2 will last at least a few years, DDR3 system memory is coming someday maybe sometime 2008... bet ehh system memory isn't as much about pure clockspeed that it is with video cards so I don't see it catching on for a while after being released. For reference, DDR2 has been out for a couple years already and DDR is still going strong and prices are about equal between similair capacities.
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#17
Robert Palmer

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Interesting observation on the memory. The memory is actually pretty cheap for what it is and from a good name (so good it's already out of stock atm :help: ) If you want to back down to 1GB that should be fine (still double what you got.) I guess when I picked it out I was so used to some Photoshop people craving as much RAM as they can get for all the layers some of em use :blink:


Hey,

Observation was all it was. Out of Stock- (Expected delivery is 8/14) Actually, I thought it was quite funny, that the memory boards WERE the highest ticket item here! Go down to 1g- [bleep] No

My concern was that 2gig of memory was the max, so I looked and saw it was expandable up to 4gig. Now thats what I'm talking about! :whistling:

I set up an account with newegg, and saved my wishlist.
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#18
Robert Palmer

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Hey,

I showed this list to a friend, and the only thing he said he would change was the hard drive.

He said, the motherboard supports Sata2, and I could get one at almost the same price, and it would
be close to twice as fast. He also like Seagates & WD hard drives only. lol

Any Opinion on that? I searched newegg for a sata2 HD, but cannot find one there.

Thanks,

Robert
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#19
MNOB07

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Sorry I don't understand, but I might just be tired. OK so what you're looking for is SATA2 and Seagate/Western Digital. Both the motherboard and harddrive in the list use SATA2 (3Gb/s) and the hard drive is one of the latest models from Seagate (I also like Seagate and Western Digital drives the best.) What else are you looking to replace and with what?
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#20
Robert Palmer

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Hey,

You must in a different time zone!

This seagate says its a SATA 3.0/gb, not a SATA2, and that SATA2 was faster.

Maybe he is wrong. He looked on newegg for a sata2 but said they didn't seem to have any HD's that were.

He did say the motherboard supported a sata2 hard drive, and it would be faster then the one you picked.

So, I myself have no idea. :whistling: Thats why I was asking, and deffinately not being cynical here.
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#21
MNOB07

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It's ok. :whistling:

As SATA2 and SATA 3gb/s are commonly used, they are synonomous with each other. However apparently SATA 3gb/s is the correct technical term, and that's why both the harddrive and the motherboard are labelled with SATA 3gb/s and not SATA2. Here's a description that makes a point that I'll link to but leaves me scratching my head:

http://www.sata-io.o...gguidelines.asp

I'll try to explain some more, you don't really have to know what I'm talking about though.

All that's important is to realize is that there is older parellel ATA and now SATA

The variants in speed between, say SATA1 and SATA2 make almost make no difference. Hard drives are mechanical and can only run maybe up to ~ 90MB/s with a single raptor drive. There is more bandwidth in all current forms of harddrive connections, and harddrive speeds are similair if you look between a certain drive using different connections. The only part of the harddrive that can take advantage of SATA 300MB/s (over SATA 3gb/s or SATA2 or SATA II) is the cache (that speed is referred to as "burst speed", now drives generally have 16MB but even that performance difference is very subjective while you're actually using the drive.

Honestly the reason everybody likes SATA and its variants over even PATA is not the speed because there is little difference there; it's that the cables are thinner and thus don't block or disrupt airflow, and that there are no "master" "slave" jumpers and you can use several at a time, just plug and play.

But anyway... the motherboard and harddrive on that list are both SATA2 SATAII SATA 3gb/s W/E so no worries :blink:
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#22
Robert Palmer

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It's ok. :whistling:

As SATA2 and SATA 3gb/s are commonly used, they are synonomous with each other. However apparently SATA 3gb/s is the correct technical term, and that's why both the harddrive and the motherboard are labelled with SATA 3gb/s and not SATA2. Here's a description that makes a point that I'll link to but leaves me scratching my head:

http://www.sata-io.o...gguidelines.asp

I'll try to explain some more, you don't really have to know what I'm talking about though.

All that's important is to realize is that there is older parellel ATA and now SATA

The variants in speed between, say SATA1 and SATA2 make almost make no difference. Hard drives are mechanical and can only run maybe up to ~ 90MB/s with a single raptor drive. There is more bandwidth in all current forms of harddrive connections, and harddrive speeds are similair if you look between a certain drive using different connections. The only part of the harddrive that can take advantage of SATA 300MB/s (over SATA 3gb/s or SATA2 or SATA II) is the cache (that speed is referred to as "burst speed", now drives generally have 16MB but even that performance difference is very subjective while you're actually using the drive.

Honestly the reason everybody likes SATA and its variants over even PATA is not the speed because there is little difference there; it's that the cables are thinner and thus don't block or disrupt airflow, and that there are no "master" "slave" jumpers and you can use several at a time, just plug and play.

But anyway... the motherboard and harddrive on that list are both SATA2 SATAII SATA 3gb/s W/E so no worries :)



Hey, I appreciate you going into detail. I followed more than the average person I would know, and the
site does say a bit too! :help: When I stop learning, it means I'm gone and buried! :blink:
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#23
MNOB07

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Is there an update on this?
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#24
Robert Palmer

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Hey,

Well, I was delayed on my purchases. Family Crisis, but the crisis went back to South Carolina.

My plan is to purchase the Case, Power Supply, and Mobo tomorrow. Unfortunately, unless I fall into
a bunch of cash, it will take me up to 3 months to get the rest.

I'll still have to get WinXP full version. I could do the XP Pro upgrade and use my 2000 Pro full install, but I'd much rather have the XP full version.

I've seen them on ebay (OEM) fo less than $100, but not sure if I should go that route.

Robert
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#25
warriorscot

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A fresh install is a good idea but not off ebay, golden rule never buy electronics off ebay and software off ebay is a mugs game.

I would keep the cash in the bank then buy everything when you can afford it that way you can take advantage of normal price depreciation and newer stuff coming out.
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#26
MNOB07

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My prayers will go out to your family, good luck with everything.

Definately wait to buy everything, either some of the stuff will get cheaper, newer better hardware will come out to replace some of it, or you may even change your mind about a few things.

And while I would never, ever buy software on ebay, hardware can be ok just try and make sure the seller is legit and see if the actual manfacturer warranty carries over to you and such..

Edited by MNOB07, 14 August 2006 - 04:09 PM.

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#27
Robert Palmer

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I would keep the cash in the bank then buy everything when you can afford it that way you can take advantage of normal price depreciation and newer stuff coming out.

Well, heres the deal. I use Paypal for my business, which pays for my dedicated server, and I re-invest about 75% on custom sites (PHP Programming) or purchse software for my computer, supplies, etc..

My wife see's I have money left over, and you know the rest! :blink:

So, if I buy a few pieces at a time, then I at least have them here, and can actually see it coming together.

While I may miss out on a few deals, etc... My wife misses out on my "extra" money! :whistling:

What I could od, is when i purchase something I'll post it, and if you guys spot something that will be better
and still work, then you can update me. I appreciate your guys help.

My prayers will go out to your family, good luck with everything.


Thank You, my step daughter will need all she can get! She thinks she knows everything.

Edited by Robert Palmer, 14 August 2006 - 04:42 PM.

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#28
Robert Palmer

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Hey,

Well, I ordered the box and the power supply.

PS arrived, and box is due tomorrow! Its a start...
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#29
Robert Palmer

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Hey Robert :whistling:

For your needs this system is going to blow away your old Compaq Presario. Athlon 64 3500+ (It would be fair to compare this processor to a Pentium 4 at 3.5Ghz), 2GB RAM, 320GB harddrive, 450 watt PSU system. Minimalistic but very capable, and has plenty of room for upgrades if you decide later on.

These are all off of Newegg, one of the best computer hardware vendors. If you can't order from them (they only ship to the states) then we can try somewhere else.

AMD Athlon 64 3500+ Orleans 2000MHz HT 512KB L2 Cache Socket AM2 Processor - Retail
http://www.newegg.co...N82E16819103633

SAMSUNG Black 16X DVD+R 8X DVD+RW 8X DVD+R DL 16X DVD-R 6X DVD-RW 5X DVD-RAM 16X DVD-ROM 48X CD-R 32X CD-RW 48X CD-ROM 2M Cache ATA/ATAPI DVD Burner With LightScribe - OEM
http://www.newegg.co...N82E16827151118

COOLER MASTER Centurion 5 CAC-T05-UW Black Aluminum Bezel, SECC ATX Mid Tower Computer Case - Retail DONE DEAL
http://www.newegg.co...N82E16811119068

Seagate Barracuda 7200.10 ST3320620AS (Perpendicular Recording Technology) 320GB 7200 RPM 16MB Cache SATA 3.0Gb/s Hard Drive - OEM
http://www.newegg.co...N82E16822148140

BIOSTAR TForce 6100 AM2 Socket AM2 NVIDIA GeForce 6100 Micro ATX RoHs compliant AMD Motherboard - Retail
http://www.newegg.co...N82E16813138027

FSP Group (Fortron Source) AX450-PN, 12cm FAN, version 2.0, 2 SATA, PCI Express, 450W Power Supply - Retail DONE DEAL
http://www.newegg.co...N82E16817104954

G.SKILL 2GB (2 x 1GB) 240-Pin DDR2 SDRAM Unbuffered DDR2 667 (PC2 5400) Dual Channel Kit System Memory - Retail
http://www.newegg.co...N82E16820231051

$569.20 shipped. $559.20 after the $10 MIR on the case.

I picked a mobo with a GeForce 6100 integrated graphics processor to save money on a seperate video card. It's pretty good for integrated, and to the best of my knowledge it's plenty for the apps you're working with but I may be wrong. If it proves inadequate, the motherboard has a PCI-E x16 slot which will work with any modern graphics card for some time.

There is no added cooling, however stock cooling, the case design, and included case fans will be plenty since the component giving off the large majority of heat will be the cpu which runs pretty cool anyway.

I hope that helps.

Hey,

I was thinking since my dedicated server has a dual core chip processor, I might look into one for this pc.
I saw a range of AMD Dual Cores from $152-$700, but I'm not even sure what to look for as far as being
compatible with the Mobo listed above.

Also, I was looking at the WindowsXP software and noticed about a $100 difference with OEM and Retail.
Whats the difference? Is it the support that comes with it?

Thanks,

Robert
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#30
MNOB07

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Hey sorry for the delay in answering your post..

Any AM2 processor will work with that mothebroard. For a budget system, a dual core is often unnecessary since they tend to cost much more and the extra core is often left idle. However the 3800+ X2 for $152 seems to be a good deal if you want to jump on that.

Windows XP OEM and retail both install the same OS. I recommend the OEM to save money I can't think of any good reason to buy the boxed version.
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