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Slightly Complicated Network Setup - Need Help


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#1
hikeleader

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I have three routers.
One wired Netgear router in basement where internet comes in to modem to the router. From that router I have cat5e connected to wireless routers on 1st and 2nd floors.
One wireless Netgear "N" router on 1st floor which is then connected to a networked device (Control4 media controller)
One wireless Microsoft router on 2nd floor that is connected to my desktop PC.

Attached is .tif image of the setup.

How do I configure these routers so that:
I can see all network resources from Laptop w/ wireless card or other wireless device?
I can see all network resources from desktop

Do I disable DHCP on the wireless routers and manually set IP addresses?

Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks
Rob

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#2
dsenette

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just as a question...if you're willing to be running cat5 through the house to each of these routers....why are you needing so many routers? why not just go from the modem with cat5 up to the N router in the middle...then either go cat up to the desktop upstairs or connect that one wirelessly if you can get a signal? the more routers the harder things get
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#3
hikeleader

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just as a question...if you're willing to be running cat5 through the house to each of these routers....why are you needing so many routers? why not just go from the modem with cat5 up to the N router in the middle...then either go cat up to the desktop upstairs or connect that one wirelessly if you can get a signal? the more routers the harder things get



I prewired the house during construction. Now that the walls are closed up it would be a helluva run from the Family Room to the office upstairs. I have all the cat5e home-runned to the basement.

I can't get a signal from the Family Room on 1st floor to the office. Even with the "N" router.
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#4
dsenette

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I prewired the house during construction. Now that the walls are closed up it would be a helluva run from the Family Room to the office upstairs. I have all the cat5e home-runned to the basement.

...so every line terminates in the basement?....and none of the "computers" are close enough to the cat that was run throughout the house? just making sure there's not another option other than the 6 million router house
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#5
hikeleader

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I have Cat5e running from Basement to the closet in the Family Room and to the office where my desktop is.

I also have Cat5e running to a few other rooms on both floors but unfortunately not all of my runs were successful! (I must have broken wire while running)

If for a moment I forgot about the wireless I can just run from router in basement straight to the media controller in the Living Room and from the basement to the Desktop in the office and I can see everything just fine. It's when I place a wireless router between the router in the basement and the MC/PC that I get in trouble.

Now, what if I just used another of the Cat5e runs from the basement just to a wireless router (acting as a wireless access point?)

Would I then be able to access the wireless signal from laptop and still be able to view/share the files on PC and MC?

Or is there a way to have the wireless routers in line like I drew in teh image but just pass through to the router in the basement.

Please excuse me...I only know enough to be dangerous but I enjoy the learning (most of the time!)
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#6
dsenette

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Now, what if I just used another of the Cat5e runs from the basement just to a wireless router (acting as a wireless access point?)

Would I then be able to access the wireless signal from laptop and still be able to view/share the files on PC and MC?

Or is there a way to have the wireless routers in line like I drew in teh image but just pass through to the router in the basement.

i think having a single wireless access point in the middle would be the best option here...now...YOU COULD have multiple routers in the mix...it's just not as easy and it's not suggested..

here's my thought...based on the info given..
what you can do is use your cat line in the office for the desktop...your cat line for the media doodad..and then just plug a wireless router in to one of your other cat drops that's working within the house...that way all 3 of these devices are on the same network...which is the issue with multiple routers....at least...multiple routers hooked up in series like you were suggesting (or at least what i think you're suggesting)...when you hook a router into a router...you've just made 3 seperate networks (the original network that the first router hooked to, the network created by the first router...and the network created by the second router)...however..if you've got all of the connecting devices (i.e. your desktop, media doodad, and the wireless router) plugged into the same backbone..you'll have alot less trouble especially when it comes down to file sharing...

i just looked at your drawing (sorry i didn't look at it before)...and theoretically it would actually work...because it LOOKS like you've got all the main routers plugged into the same backbone (i.e. all routers are connected to the cat5 drops from the basement)...so this option would probably work....you would..in this situation...want to make sure that ALL routers in the mix (past the one in the basement that everyone else connects to) are getting their IP address via DHCP from the router in the basement connected to the modem....this would actually probably give you a bit better range on the wireless...but...having more devices means there's going to be more complexity..which means more of a chance for failure...so...i still suggest using as few routers as neccessary (i.e. if there's a jack that works next to a pc....use the jack instead of a router)
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#7
hikeleader

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Call me a sadist....but if I tried it the way I drew it what settings would I need to make on the wireless routers? disable DHCP? Any IP settings I'd need to make? Is there a particualr order I should do it in?

If you can lead me in the right direction there I'll try it tonight. If I can't get it I'll try to see what I can do with your first thought. Wireless is more important downstairs than up. I'll try to run another Cat5e to the Family Room from the basement. thats not too hard to do...just have to go out and buy more wire. Or, I'll try my run into another room on the first floor and hope I didn't mangle that wire run too!
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#8
dsenette

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Give This tutorial by SpaceCowboy706 a read, it's got just about everything you'd need to know about setting up wireless and wired home networks......what you'll want is for all the routers that you're plugging into the main router...to be set to use DHCP to get their address from the router in the basement...the ip's that they give the pc's SHOULD be irrellevant so you should be able to leave the DHCP on there too...
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#9
Kurenai

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Here is what you need to do, in order:

On the two routers that are not going to be "routers," but rather wireless access points
1. Disable NAT, Network Address Translation.
2. Set the LAN IP on the access points to be within the IP scheme (normally 192.168.x, where x changes from manufacturer to manufacturer) of the one in the basement that will actually be a router. You do not want these devices getting an IP through DHCP, you may never find them again when you need to change configs. Most netgear routers use a 192.168.0.xx scheme, so my suggestion is to assign 192.168.0.254 to the Netgear N, and 192.168.0.253 to the MS. These are at the extreme end of the addressing range, making them difficult to forget. They are also IPs that the netgear router in the basement will never attempt to assign through DHCP.
3. Once the above are complete, disable dhcp on both the netgear N and MS routers. They are now wireless access points, with no routing capabilities. Essentially, a switch with wireless.
4. Connect one of the numbered (LAN) ports on the basement router to one of the numbered (LAN) ports on the netgear N. Repeat for MS. You should now be able to access the config page for each of those from any computer connected to the network, and you don't have any double nat/firewall issues that will prevent computers from connecting to each other internally (barring software firewalls).
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#10
hikeleader

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I'm halfway there.
Configured the MS router easy.
The Netgear (WNR834N) is not so cut and dry...not sure what I do to disable NAT on this modem...

I googled ad-infinitum but no luck. Any clues?
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#11
hikeleader

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I don't think there is a way to turn NAT off on this router but I was able to turn off the firewall, change the IP address, turn off DHCP and reconnected the ports and my network now sees it as a wireless access point so I must of done good!

Now tonight I see if I can get visibility to the entire network.
Thanks all for your help.
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#12
dsenette

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i don't think that disabeling NAT is a reall neccessaty...NAT (Network Adress Translation) takes the ip of the computer and encapsulates it in the IP of the router...so if your router's OUTSIDE (WAN) ip is 192.168.2.2 and your PC's ip is 192.168.1.1... then anything past that router will see it as 192.168.2.2.. not the real ip...i don't know that it SHOULD be a big concern if you can't turn it off
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#13
hikeleader

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Attached File  robsnetwork.pdf   30.14KB   291 downloadsAttached is current configuration as I remember it from here.
Does it all "look" right?

Rob
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#14
dsenette

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that should work...everything is on the same subnet...and theoretically all should be able to communicate
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#15
Kurenai

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Indeed, disabling NAT isn't 100% necesary in every case, but can prevent certain very obscure issues, so I tend to recommend it as a matter of course. Same with the firewall.

The diagram works great (and man, I wish I had users like you when I had to do support in situations like this :whistling: ). One final tip that has served me well in the past: Invest in a few sticky notes, write down the IPs and userid/password info of the device, and stick it on there. I can't count the times I've forgotten things like what IP I've assigned to a particular device, or the login info for it).
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