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Problem with CPU fan (Solved)


Best Answer pinson74 , 19 October 2014 - 09:27 PM

Well well I have good news and bad news, I found my problem and it seems it is not my motherboard. I went to the store I purchased the motherboard and the guy did not want to replace it because on... Go to the full post »


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#1
pinson74

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Hello,

 

Here is my System:

 

Mobo: Asus z-97-a

CPU  : intel i7 4790k removed hyperthreading non overclocked

SSD crucial  m550 1 To

32GB(4X8) Ram crucial ballistix tactical 1600Mhz low profile 8-8-8-24-2, I Xmp profiled it at 2133 10-9-10-24-1

power supply is EVGA supernova 850W gold certified

No graphic card yet, I still use intel graphic 4600 

I installed the cooler master 212 evo with the 4 pin fan that comes with it

one CD/DVD reader/writer

Casing is NZXT 410 phantom

I have put 2 120mm intake in front, 2 140mm exaust  on top and 1 120mm exaust on back, all 3 pins 

 

Here is my problem:

 

My Evo fan is never going faster than 600 rpm in the CPU fan slot. Setting of monitor in Bios was in PMS minimum rpm 200 no maximum set - standard mode

I can clearly see that the fan is not spinning at max even when the CPU runs at max. if I Plug it into channel 4 I can make it run up to 2000 RPM and I clearly see it run like mad and it makes the sound that goes with it. So I kept that channel4 for CPU fan instead and add to set monitor FAN on ignore. I have put my top exaust blue led 140mm NZXTFan in the CPU channel instead of the evo fan, it runs fine at standard at 800RPM and will even reach its maximum 1200 RPM when needed. So I'M like....Yeah, why is it fine with this one in the slot and not with the evo fan(that clearly show in the channel 4 that it is running perfeclty fine).  I also seen that my 140mm second exaust fan on top run between 350 and 750-800 rpm wich seems low to me.

 

All the casing fans are in DC standard minimum 200 rpm no maximum.

 

So my concern is that even if with the tweak I made my CPU run cool, I still don't like the fact that my CPU fan is not monitored into the CPU slots. What if it doesn't start and I dont notice it, it may overheat my CPU.

 

My CPU runs at 27C-28C at idle and about 80C max on really stressful prime95 sequence and around 60C on less stressfull prime95 torture test - which is perfecly fine for me as temperature goes, I could even overclock it if I wish it, but with the CPU not monitored I won't do that, I even think about downclocking the RAM back to 1600 8-8-8-24-2 since it does not affect overall capabilities much any way and it can help lower CPU temperature.

 

Do you have an idea about what can cause my problem? Every power supply plugs are well fixed, every pins are connected well, what fix could I try to do? Is it compatibility problem with EVO fan and CPU fan slot? Everything is new and built in september-October.

 

Thank you very much, have a good day, and I hope I was clear enaugh in what I have typed, sometimes I find it difficult to explain things in english.


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#2
iammykyl

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:welcome: pinson74.

Did yo have the stock cooler installed first?

if yes, did you completely remove the old TIM from the top of theCPU? tehn add new TIM, before installing the EVO?

So my concern is that even if with the tweak I made my CPU run cool, I still don't like the fact that my CPU fan is not monitored into the CPU slots. What if it doesn't start and I dont notice it, it may overheat my CPU.

If the CPU does not start, the temps will shoot up quickly and probable with 2/5/ seconds the computer will shut down.   The CPU top temp self protection will have kicked in.

I have put my top exaust blue led 140mm NZXTFan in the CPU channel instead of the evo fan, it runs fine at standard at 800RPM and will even reach its maximum 1200 RPM when needed.

Those top fans will change speed because the CPU sensor is signalling cool/warm/hot, so not controlling the CPU fan, you definitely need the CPU sensor to control the CPU fan.\

 

 

 I also seen that my 140mm second exaust fan on top run between 350 and 750-800 rpm wich seems low to me.

If they are on 2 diferent fan header, they will run at different speeds.   Solution is to use a fan splitter to connect both fans to one header, Sys fan #4.

http://www.newegg.co...N82E16812200855

 

Please try the following.

With the PSU off, take anti static measures by briefly touching a bare part of the computer case.

Connect the rear fan to Sys fan #1. D

Using the suggested splitter, connect the top fans to Sys fan #4.C

Connect the EVO fan to CPU fan (A)

Connect the front fan, if fitted, to Sys fan #3 E.

To ensure there are no conflicting settings in the BIOS, please switches like XMP at set to Defaults, then go to the exit screen and select default setting, Save and exit.   Allow boot to the desktop, then restart, enter BIOS.

 

Go to, > Monitor Menu, > click Qfan Tuning.

MB/Manual, 2.7.5. select PWM Mode.

CPU fan speed, low limit, select 300 RPM, 

CPU fan profile, select Standard.

 

MB/Manual 2.7.6. Select DC Mode.

Chassis fan warning speed. select 500 RPM.

Performance Level, select Standard.

Go to Exit, Save setting and exit. 

When testing, please use a monitor like, > http://www.cpuid.com.../hwmonitor.html to keep a close eye on temps.

When using prime95 heavy stress test, you only need to run for about 5 minutes and if the temps go over 90C, stop testing

 

If you are not happy with the results, try using the EZ Tuning Wizard, MB/Manual, 2.2.4.


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#3
pinson74

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Hello,

 

Thanks for the reply.

 

For the thermal compound, I washed it with a q-tip and a little amount of rubbing alcohol until there was no gray trace left. Then I applied new thermal compound by doing a line on the CPU then I expanded the line on the whole CPU. I hope the amount was right, I feared to put to much or to little. I doubt there is not enaugh, since it covered all the cpu at the end, and I tried to get it as thin as I could. I could have applied just a little bit more than needed but I think I've done a good job into getting a thin layer of compound and that should be ok.

 

I will default my BIOS and try to monitor my RPM with the program you suggested later this evening. I had my setup at PWM mode and RPM at minimum speed like you suggested at first when I noticed my CPU fan problem. I will try to default my BIOS this time since it's true I was with XMPed Memory when I noticed the fan RPM was stuck at 600 no matter the load on the CPU. So I will leave my memory at default DDR3 1333 setting when I'll test with CPUID.

 

When I use prime95 I never run it more than 10 minutes, I just use it to look if my temperature goes too high under stress and if my memory will cause blue screens. I know that this program isn't real life situation and I don't like to heat my system for a long time without reason and I always look at my CPU temperature while doing it, because I know running this thing can burn a CPU.

 

Right now I'm at work so there is not much I can do. I'll give you an update later on my testing. I had forgot about this site name so that's why I didn't check my topic in the weekend. I didn't abandon the topic since I really want to plug my Evo fan into the CPU slot, as it is intended to. I hope that putting the bios to default will change something.


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#4
iammykyl

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Thanks for the update.

Good, you did the correct cleaning method, FYI, it is best to use a alcohol with the highest purity you can get, (Isopropyl alcohol @ 99% pure).

If, after doing the suggestions in reply #2, your temps have not improved, consider redoing the cooler installation as you have used the hardest way to apply the TIM.

> http://www.pugetsyst...Techniques-170/

Use a non electrically conductive TIM like  > http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835186038 

Let us know how it goes.  

Good luck. 


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#5
pinson74

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Hello, here is my cpu with the CPU fan in the CPU channel and my top exaust in CH4 fan.

 

This is my Computer at idle with Default BIOS and CPU FAN at PWM minimum 300 RPM. It runs smooth and cool with CPU fan at around 600 RPM.

Attached Thumbnails

  • IDLE non XMP.jpg

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#6
pinson74

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Then, I will stress it in prime 95, this image was with 4 worker(I could have put 8 with Hyperthreading, I have done it and I get the same temperature).

 

With 4 and 8 worker, I got the same topped temperature at 58C. See that my CPU fan is still running around 600RPM as stated.

Attached Thumbnails

  • prime95 stressed non XMP.jpg

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#7
pinson74

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Ok so now I want to show you that with my CPU fan in the right slot, even if the temperature goes up, it will still stay around 600 RPM. To prove that, I have no choice, let's go back to XMP profile, this will auto setup my ddr3 ram to 1600 8-8-8-24-2 and allow my 44X100 turbo boost multiplier instead of 40X100 on default BIOS.

 

Now, with 400 extra MHz, the temperature rise to 80C and I stopped the test because the next test to come would have caused even more heat on the CPU and I could not have allowed that.

Notice that, surprisingly, my CPU fan is still stuck at around 600RPM(but why?????).

Attached Thumbnails

  • Stressed on XMP profile.jpg

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#8
pinson74

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Ok so now, let's swipe the CPU fan and the CH4 fan plugs into the motherboard.

I will set CH4(with my heat sink CPU fan) bios set up to PMW mode standart and minimum RPM at 300.

 

I will set CPU FAN channel (with my top exaust 140mm fan) to DC mode, standart and minimum RPM at 300.

I will also disable the monitoring of that channel to ignore so that I am allowed to boot.

 

Now I run the prime 95 blend test. At the spot where I had to cancel my previous test with the fans plugged normally because my CPU reached 80C(and it could have raise higher, I stopped it to prevent harm to my CPU), I was around 67-68C. Then the test completed and it started test 2 wich is the most stressfull on CPU heat blend test and I topped at 77C. Which seems reasonable to me. Note that this time, my actual CPU Heatsink fan is running over 1800RPM(tripple the previous speed) in the CH4 slot and you can see that my 140mm exaust fan runs normally around its 1150-1200RPM in the designed CPU fan slot.

 

Why can my exaust fan can run normally in my CPU fan slot when my 4 pin CPU fan can't is beyond me. Why does my CPU 4 pin fan does work perfectly in the CH4 slot. Is it because of a possible problem with my 4th CPU FAN pin on the motherboard. This is the only thing I can think of. Like, 3 pins out 4 could be working while the other pin to fix the PWM fan spin would be defective, which would be why my 3 pin 140mm exaust fan works but not my 4 pin heat sink fan? But then again, if it was like that, my 4 pin fan should then work in DC mode like the 3 pin fan isn't it??(or does 4pins fans require to be set up to PMW and cannot work in DC??). Do you think it's plausible?

 

What do you think about it?

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  • XMP profile stressed swapped fans.jpg

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#9
pinson74

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Oh by the way I also tried your HWmonitor at CPUID and it only monitor CHfan 1-2-3 and it doesn't even show CPU fan. So I sticked with my asus program.


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#10
iammykyl

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Please read the whole post before altering/testing. 

 

Reply $5.

Temps are good because at idle, the CPU fan at 600 rpm is fast enough.

****************************

Reply #6.

600 rpm can still keep the temps within reason, but I think it  should have increased.  Can you have a look at the fan profile for the CPU.(A) socket, (in the BIOS)  I would think it should be set to start to increase speed at about 35/40C.   If that is the case, there could be a faulty controller in the fan.   When the CPU temps rise, a signal is sent to the controller in the fan, to increase voltage/speed.   Options,   Replace with a PMW fan, (simplest), or install the stock cooler.  If the result is still 600 rpm, suspect the MB sensor.  

*********************************

Reply #8 

"I will set CH4(with my heat sink CPU fan) bios set up to PMW mode standart and minimum RPM at 300."

I don't think there is a heat sensor connected to that ch4 socket, the fan is running at it's max speed. which gives the lower temps. If you just let the system idle, does the fan still run at full speed? 

 

" I topped at 77C. Which seems reasonable to me. Note that this time, my actual CPU Heatsink fan is running over 1800RPM(tripple the previous speed)"

which gives the lower temps. If you just let the system idle, does the fan still run at full speed? 

 

"you can see that my 140mm exaust fan runs normally around its 1150-1200RPM in the designed CPU fan slot."

​I think this is because it is a 3 pin fan, so the 4th (sensor wire) is not being used.

************************

Please try.

1.   Top exhaust fan connected to Sys fan #4.

CPU EVO connected to CPU (A), set control to DC, standard Mode.   Does the fan ramp up as the heat increases? or run at top speed.

 

2.   The CPU (A) and (B) sockets are linked. the (A) is used for 1 main fan and the PMW pin is active.   The (B) is for a second fan.   the PMW 

pin is not active, so the signal from the (A) controls and delivers the same amount of current to both fans and should run at the same speed. 

Taking into account that this is all software controlled, there might be a bug or corruption.

Try connecting the EVO to socket (B) and test with both PMW and DC modes. .   Any difference to using (A)?

 

3.   Try the options for Reply to #8.

 

I do hope that it all makes sense. 

 

 

Edit.

 

Try Speedfan.


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#11
pinson74

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Hello,

 

Reply #6.

600 rpm can still keep the temps within reason, but I think it  should have increased.  Can you have a look at the fan profile for the CPU.(A) socket, (in the BIOS)  I would think it should be set to start to increase speed at about 35/40C.   If that is the case, there could be a faulty controller in the fan.   When the CPU temps rise, a signal is sent to the controller in the fan, to increase voltage/speed.   Options,   Replace with a PMW fan, (simplest), or install the stock cooler.  If the result is still 600 rpm, suspect the MB sensor.

 

 

My reply

 

You are right, it should increase from what the BIOS is showing, but it isn't as it always stays around 600 RPM.

I think the answer to my problem is in this reply, I suspect the MB sensor pin with both the CPU FAN and CPU Optional. What tells me this is because, I have done some fan expert tune-up before I went to bed, and I also did the equivalente into the BIOS with Q-Control option and it happens that it reads my 4 pin fans as a 634RPM fan at minimum RPM and as a 612RPM at maximum speed, which actually cause a small decrease in RPM from 0% to 100% charge on the CPU instead of....RISING!

 

Well so I have tried the same tune up with my 4 pin fan in the CH4 and this time, it was read as a minimum around 800 RPM and around Maximum RPM 2000. Which means, the fan controller is all right, and therefor the motherboard sensor on CPU fan seems broken(and to be honnest I don't feel like to RMA my board for a defective pin and wait a while to use the computer, + having to disassemble the thing and reassemble later). So, it seems I will have to swap my 4 pin fan with a 3 pin fan. In this regard, do you have an idea about a 3pin fan that would be perfect for static pressure in a heat sink. I have terrible luck with fans, I have already a fractal design silent r2 séries 40.8airflow supposed to be 15DB but it actually is my loudest fan, even louder than the evo fan, so I will just remove it from my casing and replace it with the evo fan and then add a new good 3 pin 120mm fan on the heatsink. Does Noctua makes good 3 pin fans? They are expensive but everyone says they are truly silent with sufficient efficiency, but I fear their low ventirad would not be enaugh.

 

Reply #8 

"I will set CH4(with my heat sink CPU fan) bios set up to PMW mode standart and minimum RPM at 300."

I don't think there is a heat sensor connected to that ch4 socket, the fan is running at it's max speed. which gives the lower temps. If you just let the system idle, does the fan still run at full speed?

 

My reply

Well there is a heat sensor in it, it can be set to tract CPU or MB.

 

Also about the testing you are suggesting, I have tryed it and for a reason I ignore, when I set my 4pin fan to DC and standard in the CPU it just stop, and it will run around 600 RPM if set to DC and Maximum.

It is the same when I plug it into CPU optionnal and I need to set the monitoring to ignore to be able to boot on fan error.

 

About trying  speed fan, I will take a look after work.

 

Thanks a lot for the help.


Edited by pinson74, 15 October 2014 - 08:23 AM.

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#12
pinson74

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I am thinking about may be trying this fan:

 

http://www.newegg.ca...N82E16835608037


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#13
iammykyl

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A Noctua fan is what I would have recommended, they are the only ones I use.

The NF-S12A is best suited as a case fan,                1200 RPM  Airflow 107,5 m³/h Static Pressure 1,19 mm H2O  Noise 17,8 dB(A)

The NF-F12  is best for a heatsink, use the L.N.A  1200 RPM  Airflow   74,3 m³/h Static Pressure 1,83 mm H2O  Noise 18,6 dB(A)                                                    

 

NF-S12A  3 pin, http://www.noctua.at...55&lng=en&set=1

NF-F12    4 pin, also try in the CPU B socket, http://www.noctua.at...42&lng=en&set=1

Noctua recommendation,  > http://www.noctua.at/main.php?show=which_fan_is_right_for_me&lng=en 


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#14
pinson74

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Hello,

 

I have done a few more test, I have ezflashed my bios with the latest bios update for my motherboard, it did not change my fan problem. I also tried to disable Q-FAN control, may be that's what that was buggy. Still stayed stuck around 600RPM. I had tested my Connector into the CPU-Optionnal it does not work right too.

 

I'Ve found that the NF-P12 is in between the S12 and the F12 and it can be used with a 3 pin connector. I'll then buy this one.

 

Thanks again for the help.


Edited by pinson74, 15 October 2014 - 08:41 PM.

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#15
iammykyl

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You are welcome.  We would appreciate a update with the results after you have installed the new fan.

Thanks.  


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