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XP SP3 - Attempts to update software result in looping.


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#1
RonS2

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I'm running a Dell dimension 3000 XP Home SP3, 512 RAM 70Gb HD with a 500Gb external HD. Internal HD about 50% used , external about 10% used. The machine crashed out recently refusing to get beyond the Dell logo when booting. My repair man cleaned it up, reinstalled from my CD and replaced SP3. Also replaced all my Emails and left me with a folder of saved folders.
I've been reinstalling all the stuff with a good degree of success, but have had a couple of setbacks. My BT Hub is working well but I cannot display the BT icon which allows my NETwork to be shown. If I click on the BT broadband Help icon I get a 'Automated server can't detect object' message and if I attempt a repair using my BT CD it goes about 95% down the line and then loops as it is attempting to install the last few bits. I have shied away from attempting a full replacement of the Hub programs in case I lose my internet link.
Last night when closing down the machine I got a message that Windows would be updating 4 programs and it duly set off saying 'updating 1 of 4' whilst BT marketing division regaled me with blurb about their excellent systems. Half an hour leter I was still getting that same '1 of 4' message and the BT ads were circulating nicely still.
I've run CClean, Euling Free Registry Cleaner, Malwarebytes Anti-Malware, SuperAnti Spyware, and AVASTI full scan and there has been no report of any malware.
I think that I may have accepted an update for Java a couple of days ago, but other than that I can't remember any alteration to software,
Would be grateful for any advice which will help me clear this up.
With apologies for excessively lengthy explanation.
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#2
Macboatmaster

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Hello.

1.

Euling Free Registry Cleaner

That is a mistake. The registry NEVER needs cleaning. A registry key many in very specific circumstances, need editing, by using regedit command. These automated registry cleaning programs are not recommended on this site. They are generally a gimmick and often dangerous to the health of the computer. Many of them will find so called errors on a brand new computer. For the opinion of an expert, see the link on my signature notes. That is My Link.
OR HERE is the comment of a Microsoft expert after Eusing found what it said were OVER 1000 errors.
Basically if you have used a registry cleaner and it has an Undo feature you should use it and uninstall the program. I would not worry about - or do anything - about registry entries found by a registry cleaner. Even if you have some extra registry entries, they will not affect how Windows XP/Vista/7 perform one whit.

Neither should you use the registry aspect of CCleaner.
ATF cleaner is far better for you as it does NOT in anyway alter the registry
Here is the link.
http://www.atribune....id=25&Itemid=25

2. Not specific to this problem but 512Mb of ram could be very usefully increased. It is one of the cheapest ways of greatly improving performance.

3. NOW TO YOUR PROBLEM
How are you connecting to the BT Hub, wireless or hard wired.
The BT CD installs a number of programs which are simply resource using and unnecessary. You DO NOT need these to use the Hub and your computer will run far better, due to the small amount of ram you have, without them.
Go Start, Control Panel, Network connections and there will appear your connection/s.
Post back please with which you are using.

Edited by Macboatmaster, 19 February 2011 - 03:44 PM.

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#3
RonS2

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Thanks/Diolch Macboatmaster

(1) Point taken - I'll drop Eusing and have already downloaded ATF Cleanert.

(2) Agreed but it's fast enough for me generally - I'm sifting through genealogical files and not playing games. I think I'm limited to 1Gb on this machine anyway.

(3) This machine is hard wired , the only other m/c on our net is my wife's laptop which is wifi.

Machine is painfully slow this morning (11:00 hrs UK time)
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#4
Macboatmaster

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Go Start, Run and type "msconfig" without quotes.
On the window that opens click the StartUp tab and either screen shot it, you may have to do this twice so that I then have a list of all the startup programs.

To screenshot when you have on the screen the image you want you press the Print screen key and then go start, programs, accesories, paint and when paint opens click the edit tab and then click paste.
The screenshot will appear in paint. Then click the File tab and click SAVE AS. in the type of file select JPEG. the default Bitmap is too large.
Save to where you wish and then attach to your next post.

One of the reasons for a slow startup is too many programs running at StartUp and all of these have to be loaded before Windows will start.
If you feel able to alter this list yourself you simply uncheck the box by the side of any entry that you KNOW does not need to be loaded at StartUp.

Another reason for slow performance when opening a browser is a large number of add-ons etc.
These can be edited if you are on Internet Explorer by clicking on Tools and then Manage Add-ons. On Toolbars and Extensions the various HELPERS anmd ASSISTANTS can be safely disbaled.
On Search Providers - just keep the ones you want I would advise not more than two, Programs frequently are downloaded with another search provider offered and installed automatically on the download.
On Accelerators you may safely disable them all.
If you are using Firefox the procedure is more or less the same, you click Tools and then click Add-ons.

If you are using BT Yahoo as your Home Page, usually the one defaulted with BT as your ISP then I advise you to change it to Google. It has far less adverts, far less clutter and will load and be ready while BT Yahoo is still thinking about it..

YOU DO NOT NEED all of that software on the BT CD installed. Your BT Hub will function perfectly without it as per my item 3 on Post 2.
I strongly recommend you uninstall all of the BT program. Using add and remove programs.




Please do this and post back -how it is and then we will continue with a further exmaination of what may be the cause.
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#5
RonS2

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Thanks for your suggestions & Apologies for delay in replying -

I do always use msconfig to ensure that no malware has invited itself into the machine. In the same way I look into Control Panel/Add programs and check there for intruders. I have Online Armor and Avasti running so expect to have some protection.

At this moment Startup has only 3 entries :-
AvastiUI ; oaui ; cftmon

I have unchecked SMax4pnp (Sound related) ; reader_sl & Adobe ARM & Language (Adobe related) ; igfxtray & igfxpers & hkcmd (Graphics related) ; msmmsgs ; Nero check ; SuperantiSpyware ;PDVDServer (powerdvd).

I have also cleaned out All Toolbars , Helpers, Assistants from AddIns

BTYAhoo is my EMail source but I use Google mostly and occasionally I.Explorer for any searches. Have long since zapped Conduit and any other similar options offering themselves.

I do want to be able to look at my local Net and the BT program is the only way I have used so I'd like tp retain that icon & its software.

Having done all this the machine is still a bit slower than of old, but this is infinitely more tolerable than the fact that I cannot get ANY updates to succeed, I've yesterday noticed that I do not have a JAVA folder within my Control Panel. Plenty of Java files and folders (of various vintage) still held within the C:\ drive. I tried to download/update from the Java site on the net, but could not get the update to perform

Am I at the stage (again) where I need to clean out evrything and start again.?
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#6
Macboatmaster

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I have Online Armor and Avasti


OnLine Armour is I presume the free firewall.

Ensure you do NOT have the Windows Firewall running as well.
If you do, this may well be the reason for the slowness.

AVASTI - I presume you mean Avast if you do NOT mean Avast but AVASTI.
I suggest you uninstall it immediately and install another anti-virus.
This link is the genuine AVAST
http://www.avast.com/en-gb/index

AVASTI is unwanted.
Perhaps you have mistaken this unwanted and indeed I would say dangerous program for the genuine AVAST
http://www.mywot.com...ee.qarchive.org
That link is SAFE it is the Web of Trust report on Avasti.
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#7
RonS2

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OOPS ! My typo - Sorry

Not a single a v a s t i in the place - I checked.

ONLINE ARMOR has a firewall and asks acceptance for every intrusion that it detects and is asking for entry. It's very efficient but often annoying because it will ask a question of you, naming something that you've never previously heard of and give you only two options - Accept or Reject - 'twould be nice to have a button for 'come back in 15 minutes after I've looked this up'.
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#8
Macboatmaster

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Online Armor runs on Windows XP SP3 (32bit), Vista SP2 (32bit) and 7 (32bit & 64bit). To ensure optimal performance we recommend a computer with a Pentium 4 processor or newer and at least 512 MB RAM (1 GB would be better).

Quote from the Online Armor.

Ensure you do NOT have the Windows Firewall running as well.

This is what I was asking. I have looked for you and Online Armor disables the Windows firewall.
That said, you do not have sufficient system resources to run Online Armor AND expect the computer to still be responsive.

What is the error message when you try to install an update. ?

As a test - go to a trusted update site. Disable Avast, Disable Online Armor and try the update - ie Windows Update.
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#9
RonS2

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I disabled Avast and Online Armor

entered 'Windows Update' in Google and duly got an offer to express update something - was a bit baffled to see that the line above the offer said 0 bytes, but thought that it would probably insert that later.

Got screen saying :-
INSTALLING UPDATES
The updates are being installed
initialization status : done
Installing Microsoft .NET Framework 3.5 Service Pack 1 and .NET Framework 3.5 Family Update for .NET versions 2.0 through 3.5 (kb951847) x86 (update 1 of 1)
INSTALLING

Under "INSTALLING" there was a slim box that looked as though there should be a progress bar running along it. But there was nothing and although the computer was occasionally chugging away - there was still nothing.

Knowing that the machine was slow I decided to sweat it out.

25 minutes later the screen changed to say "Some updates were not installed"

I got an opportunity to click on "View Windows History" and it produced a list of updates going back to 16th Feb, Included in that list were 4 identical updates to the one I had just attempted. On 17th Feb it had failed twice , on 18th feb it had succeeded and on 19th Feb it had failed again. I decided to print the list and did so, I had not known previously of the existance of such a list and on this occasion I failed to notice that one can click on the red buttons alongside failures in order to see what went wrong. The list unfortunately vanished from the screen and despite searching I can't find a method of recalling it. (Any suggestions ?)

T0 my surprise the list when it printed out did not show details of todays efforts, I know that they were showing on the screen before I printed it , but the list starts with 20th Feb.

At no time was any error code shown. Indeed for all the update crashes that I have had there are never any error codes , the update just goes sullen and silent and usually locks the computer . Escape is only possible by pressing the start button and holding it.

If you would like to see the list I can scan it as a .JPG and attempt to attach it.
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#10
Macboatmaster

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Go back to Windows Update and on the left pane click Update History..
Select critical updates.
HOW MANY ARE NOW OFFERED.
The Net Framework SP update is LARGE.
Try a smaller update first, the size is shown at the side of the update.
See if that will download and install..


The fact that some are being accepted and not others suggests there MAYBE a connection problem.
If auto updates are commissioned and some are downloading, as it only uses the internet when you are NOT using it, if you then shut down, that update that was partially downloaded will show as a failure.
I recently worked on a laptop where the owner was not aware of the importance of checking updates in progress on the taskbar. She had over 75 failures in amongst just 12 successes.

Go start, right click My computer, click properties and click the hardware tab, click the device manager button - any warnings on any drivers please.






HAVE YOU RUN THE ATF CLEANER.

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#11
Macboatmaster

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I do want to be able to look at my local Net and the BT program is the only way I have used so I'd like tp retain that icon & its software.


See this please AND please take my advice. . You do not need, nor indeed can you afford to have all that BT software programs on your PC
http://www.filesavea.../bthomehub.html

Here's a quick summary of how to get connected to BT Total Broadband using a BT Home Hub:

  • First off, each telephone in the house will have to be connected to the phone socket via a special filter once Broadband Advice is enabled. Other devices that have to connect to your phone line, such as answerphones and set-top boxes (including the Sky digibox), will also need to be connected via a microfilter.
  • Plug the broadband lead into the ADSL socket on the filter into the Broadband line socket on the Home Hub
  • Plug the Home Hub into the mains, using the supplied power adapter
  • After a few minutes, the 'Wireless' , 'Broadband' and 'Internet' lights should be on (The BT guide advises you to wait an hour while the line optimises and gains the fastest speed).
  • Next off, you're meant to install the BT Total Broadband software, supplied on CD. HOWEVER, you don't need to. If your PC is running XP or Vista, you won't need to use the supplied BT software CD, as when you connect your Home Hub to the PC, Windows has all of the software you need. By not using the CD, you won't get lots of unneeded software installed, including: BT Broadband Desktop Help, BT Yahoo Internet Software, Hub Manager and BT Broadband Talk Setup. You can manage your Home Hub via a standard web browser, so don't need BT's software to clutter your PC.
  • Then, plug in an Ethernet lead from your PC's network port to the Home Hub Ethernet port.
  • As if by magic, it should all work. The Home Hub is set for DHCP, and BT Total Broadband doesn't require a username or password to log on (as they use your phone number to authenticate)

Edited by Macboatmaster, 22 February 2011 - 05:21 PM.

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#12
RonS2

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Replying to your earlier of the two posts -
Yes I've run ATF. Twice last one five minutes ago. Bit disconcerted 'cos it doesnt show you what it's found - but it runs very quickly so OK.

Looked at Windows Update. Only one express update there and that was the one that we've already tried. Looked at custom choice updates and found about 6 to do but only one was not assocuated with the .NET Framework updates, so chose that kb 971029 935kbytes. Went through like a dream in about 2 mins. No problem.
Incidentally ALL the updates for .NET / Framework are showing zero file size in the list.

Looked again at the History list.
Starts 12th Feb 24 updates all successful
13th Feb - 2 attempts at kb 911895 both failed error 0x800 70005
14th 2 attempts at 911895 both failed 0x800 080110
16th 2 successes kb911895 , kb2415472
17th 2 failures kb951847 error 0xC0000006 ; kb951847 error 0x643
18th kb 951847 had grey circle with a dash in it, not red failure or green success.
18th 3 successes - kb 979909 , 2418241 , 983583.
19th 1 failure kb 951847 error 0x800 70005
20th 2 successes kb 982168 , 963707 .
22nd 5 failures all with error 0x645 - kb979909, 982168, 2418241, 983583, 982524.
22nd 1 failure kb 951847 error 0x8007064C
22nd 1 success kb 961118
22nd 1 failure kb2416472 error 0x664
22nd 1 failure error 0x800 7064C

I dont understand why when an update is successful it may be run again later on and fail.

Checked out the Device manager but could not see any sign of any warnings .

All for now will reply to other post tomorrow.
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#13
Macboatmaster

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Please install this
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/943144

Method one Windows Update Agent. pls ensure you select the correct one.

Edited by Macboatmaster, 22 February 2011 - 07:08 PM.

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#14
RonS2

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Have just LOST two separate attempts to add a post to this thread, one when I wrote in FAST REPLY and attempted to 'post' and the other when I put it into FULL EDITOR and as I attempted to do a correction it disappeared.

This brief message is therefore a TEST to see if it will ADD to our thread.
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#15
Macboatmaster

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This brief message is therefore a TEST to see if it will ADD to our thread.

Yes, as you will probably know it did.
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